Author Topic: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings  (Read 5778 times)

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Offline _Tamra_

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2018, 02:57:51 PM »
+3
All those item adjustments are okay, but considering these are in the game since some time now and people already loomed those kind of fucks them over, not?
See previous posts for example as well as many Yumi bows not able to use on horseback and changed 0-1 slot items.

Incoming heirloom exchanges for these people? Or make the sale earlier than announced.
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Offline Kenda

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2018, 03:36:23 PM »
+3
Excellent changes in general, thanks for the good work.

I'm a little sad seeing the Two Handed Warhammer buffed by 3 damage being a big fan of the Bar Mace which is now basically straight up inferior with only a 2 in dmg difference.  :(

But why dafuq would u guys nerf blunt.

Blunt is so good right now its ridiculous, all blunt weapons deal insane damage since everyone is so armored and it knockdowns aswell. The nerf does however leave 1h with less viable options if they want to do legit damage since 1h cut weapons are so weak in this meta.
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Offline Osiris

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2018, 05:31:46 PM »
+1
about rapier.

With rapier equipped i have one in my hand and another in the scabbard for some reason.

also one mode has only stab and the other mode has all 4 attack directions but the one locked stab only has 1 more piece? why would anyone use that mode
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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2018, 05:34:49 PM »
0
i never understood that but why every time a new item is added it's never shown on crpg site? i don't mind it, i know it's gonna get fixed eventually but i never understood why it always takes a while. as for the rest, 'tis a good patch, maybe the buff on 2h warhammer is a bit too much but for the rest it's fine, good job
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Offline DaveUKR

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2018, 06:28:04 PM »
+1
@Ikarus: Decreasing class diversity isn't a goal I want to get behind. Dave's Strength increase would have effectively removed a more dedicated more invested arbalest build and buffed melee hybridization. I don't agree with that direction. While I can see the perks of xbowers having higher power strike higher iron flesh and more melee wpf due to higher accuracy via accuracy buff I can't get behind that change entirely.  I am more inclined to agree with donkey crew's previous balance work with xbows leaving their investments at 8 full wm points for arb 7 full wm points for heavy while the lower tier xbows serve as a hybrid weapon.

I do, however, agree with the partial price increase, for now, to see how that might affect the class.

As it stands we are still tweaking armor soak. Xbow has effectively received a damage nerf based on what armor is on the other side of the bolt. It's a fairly gimped class compared to 2012. Gimping it further is not something I want to do. Just for transparency after about 2 months of monitoring its damage. It has gotten anywhere from 8 piercing damage *high armor* to 83 piercing damage *naked* via body shot ofc with a variety of armors being hit. Averaging around 27 P damage which is ideal as that is 2-3 shot for most players in the vast majority of armor sets. with 1 shot being possible while 3-4 shot is not out of the question for plate users.

Having 15 strength -1 strength for arb (the only change this round) will not drastically effect the class in any way. Freeing up 2 points is not note worthy and those 2 points being tied down only limited diversity of builds as is. I happen to agree with rico and professor on lowering the strength requirement by 1 despite my initial hesitation.


You misunderstood the conception of my suggestion. Lowering STR reqs you only let players have ultra high AGI builds with a lot of wpf in both crossbows and melee + a lot of athletics. Yet heavy crossbow is still not nerfed being the ultimate imba weapon. And increasing the amount of Bolts in stack was also the opposite of my suggestion.

If you're telling me that crossbowmen are a gimped class now then you must leave the balance team since you have completely no idea of real things. Arbalest is _somewhat_ gimped because of being 4 slot weapon (and that's arguably because there are much more and better 0 slot weapons), but the rest of crossbows and especially heavy crossbows are much better options than in 2012.

Offline illogical

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2018, 06:35:16 PM »
0
Can add secondary mode, like rapier for other swords with high thrust damage и long length. Spathion, Paramerion, Estoc and other.
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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #21 on: February 03, 2018, 06:39:14 PM »
0
If you're telling me that crossbowmen are a gimped class now then you must leave the balance team since you have completely no idea of real things.

it's perfectly acceptable for everyone to have their own opinions, but please refrain from attacking someone just because they don't share your point of view. when it comes to serious discussion of the game, it's imperative that you try to beat ideas using reason and not insults.
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Offline DaveUKR

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2018, 07:00:27 PM »
0
it's perfectly acceptable for everyone to have their own opinions, but please refrain from attacking someone just because they don't share your point of view. when it comes to serious discussion of the game, it's imperative that you try to beat ideas using reason and not insults.

I am harsh not only because of what's done but mostly because how it's motivated. The motivation of such changes shows zero competence. If you share it - then you are a "zero competence" material too as a game balancer. I guess I did more than I should to "beat ideas using reason".

Offline Blackbow

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2018, 07:10:33 PM »
0
so now the most powerfull ranged class is the only one who can have :
around 8 and 10 ath
around 170 wpf in xbow
around 100 and 140 in melee

When an xbower is shooting you, you generaly dont know where he is.
The time you search for him you take an other shot and if you survived to this and you finaly find him he gonna run away to an other place or to his team mate and he will finish you with a third shot...

and because archers are priority target and an easy target for xbowers, archers will be fucked so hard...
let me remind you something about archery:
archers carry 2 quivers of 5.2 weight each ( so 10.4 weight just for arrows)
they need a minimum of 24 str to deal damage but the majority atm is more like 27 str so they generaly have a maximum of 5 or 6 ath...
and because str builds they cant have any wpf in melee ...

but xbowers are allowed to get 8/10 ath and tons of wpf, insane accuracy and lot of dmg .... just lol guys u are so good...
i start to think there is no good xbowers on na, not like the rats we have on eu1 and it's probably for that you dont see the problem ...

i remember what tydeus said when he forced archers to be str whore:
"you need strengh to bend your bow so its logical"
look like you dont need str to reload an xbow lol ....


and what the points to ask dave (dave is one of the best and oldest xbower in eu) what he think about xbows if its to make the opposite
once again nightingale manage to buff his op class... and please proffessor dont take his defense... he is doing this since years...

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keeping in mind they dont have pd/pt requierement i just applied bows rules...
job is done now all ranged class are balanced you are welcome  :mrgreen:

Arbalest
Requirement: old 15 strength new 21 strength

Heavy Crossbow
Requirement: old 12 strength new 18 strength

Crossbow
Requirement: old 10 strength new 15 strength

Light Crossbow
Requirement: old 9 strength new 12

Hunting Crossbow
Requirement: old 7 strength new 9 strength
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Offline Blackbow

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2018, 07:57:32 PM »
-1
i have to add:
good job devs and item balancers, now we have to fight an army of xbow shielders on eu1 ...wich make them barely impossible to kill...
xbow shield new meta !
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 08:44:24 PM by Blackbow »
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Offline Asheram

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2018, 08:24:35 PM »
0
Thank you Professor for all your hard work on the mod and attempts to keep it alive and fun for all.

I dont want compensation in the form of loompoints back for my nerfed light xbow. I would like compensation in the form of a free respec on Asheram. I just used my free respec 3 days ago, it took me 3 days wait to use it because Asheram was my strat hero. I respeced him to actually put some points in HA and wpf points in crossbow for a change as I have been just using light xbow w/o any and now you nerfed the only xbow that I use so I would like to respec back to what I was.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 08:28:54 PM by Asheram »
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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #26 on: February 03, 2018, 08:43:15 PM »
+1
dave is one of the best and oldest xbower in eu

Does he play any other classes?

Cos 'balance' is about balance between all classes, not just what the best and oldest of a single class thinks.

A change to one class effects all the others.
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Offline Blackbow

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #27 on: February 03, 2018, 08:46:16 PM »
0
Does he play any other classes?

Cos 'balance' is about balance between all classes, not just what the best and oldest of a single class thinks.

A change to one class effects all the others.
yes he does
now ask yourself about item balancers...
i have doubt about some of them
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Offline Fortem

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #28 on: February 03, 2018, 08:49:16 PM »
+1
Item name: Executioner Sword
Why you believe you deserve compensation: I am an archer and I needed a 1 slot sword, this sword is useless to me now.

Offline bensai

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Re: 0.5.2.4: Auto-Balance, and other Balancings
« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2018, 08:50:31 PM »
+7
thank you for the patch professor.

here are some minor issues i have found with the new items

bishop helmet: bad face clipping issues (yes my face is fucked up but its a full head helmet)
(click to show/hide)

1h morningstar: is it missing its texture?
(click to show/hide)

rapier: someone else mentioned this; it has two modes
   -- one with stab only, one with all four directions. I hope it's a 4d weapon since the cut is only 24 and the speed/length dont really justify the pierce only attack/damage in my swashbucklers opinion
   -- there is still a rapier model in the scabbard when the sword is drawn
   -- if sheathed and then drawn while in 4d mode, the rapier is pulled from the back like a throwing weapon
*you could leave it with both modes, but maybe have the stab only mode buffed a little bit? damage or speed? or add ghost reach
« Last Edit: February 04, 2018, 01:24:28 AM by bensai »
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